Lol thanks for reminding me why I love Star Wars but always avoid the communities and fans at every possible cost 👍
Luke trying to kill Ben bugged me. I don’t mind that Luke wound up a crazy old hermit, all of his mentors did, but the fact that the guy who redeemed Vader decided to murder his nephew after one bad dream annoyed me.
deleted by creator
LOL, it was your phrase dude. Also, there are two versions of the scene; Ben’s retelling, where Luke swung at him, and Luke’s retelling, where he didn’t. I think Luke’s version is probably more accurate, but even then he pulled out his weapon, ignited it, and nearly swung before hesitating. So let’s say, “Luke almost trying to kill Ben,” if you wanna be pedantic about your own words.
Removed by mod
This is regarding the post rather than this specific comment.
You’ve constructed a thread nearly guaranteed to have uncivil arguments in the comments. Right or wrong in the details of your argument, you’ve invited yet another moshpit of negativity about Star Wars.
If you don’t like the sequels, it seems obtuse to make a thread arguing with other people who also don’t like them, but are doing it “wrong”. If you do like the sequels, posting positively about them and letting your enjoyment change peoples’ minds is more constructive than trying to debate people into enjoying them.
You are a very prolific poster on lemmy. Your posts get a lot of visibility, and therefore do contribute to setting a tone. If you like Star Wars, why make that tone negative?
Food for thought.
deleted by creator
Like I said you’ve constructed a thread at people and designed to cause arguments. If you like the sequels, make a post about what you like and convince people by showing them what good you see, rather than telling them what they see is wrong.
This isn’t a comment in the debate style where I’m going to go back and forth with you and snip out tidbits of your post to get the worst reading on them. I’m trying to talk, not debate. I’m not trying to “win” but cutting you down. I’m trying to convince you to contribute to making Star Wars threads about Star Wars rather than about fandom infighting.
Chew on it a bit.
To be fair, even assuming Luke’s retelling is accurate, it kinda felt super out of character for him to “unknowingly ignite his lightsaber”. Last time we saw the guy in movie cannon, he had just thrown away his lightsaber while facing down two Sith Lords, so strong was his belief in the good within his father. He was a Jedi Master, trained by Yoda to control his emotions. And I dont think it would be unfair to assume he got better at this since ROTJ.
But instead, he got so bad at self control that he pulled out his weapon on his nephew, over a bad premonition. Then when shit hit the fan, gives up completely and goes full hermit mode. Just didn’t feel like Luke to me. Instead it felt like Rian Johnson just wanted to make a point about hero worship and to subvert expectations.
I agree with your overarching points in the meme. But I’ll always be sad to see, what felt to me like, the character assassination of Luke Skywalker.
he got so bad at self-control
That’s literally the point though. Just like how the impentrable, saint-like Jedi Order failed to pay attention to the rot and carelessness in their own organization, so too did the last Jedi forget that he is not perfect, and he stopped working on himself.
The Jedi Order did not rot from within, the Republic rotted around them.
Palpatine changed the game the Sith had played for millennia. Realizing he/they now I guess could not win a direct conflict with the Jedi, he instead played a game they could not play without becoming the Sith in everything but name themselves.
To fight the political corruption of the Republic, what would they have had to do?
Burst into the Senate chambers and arrest every Senator in sight?
Seize control and institute fully automatic gay luxury space communism?
Well, actually, yes, they should have done that, as well as invading Tattoine to end the slave trade, but Lucas would never have written that so what else you got?
Executing Anakin for being both too dangerous to train and leave alone?
It’s just an idiot’s argument to pretend the Jedi losing one battle in their ten thousand year old war against the Sith means the Order was wrong about everything. The kind of mindless prattling that you get when you put a random director in charge of a simple series he still fails to understand.
If it worked for you, more power to you. My ramblings are nothing more than the butthurt musings of an OT fanboy. And maybe I’ll always be blinded by those lenses.
Fwiw, I did understand the point they were trying to make, and I get that it is possible for a person to change over decades, and not always for the better.
But for me, regardless of the point, it was too large a departure from the core of Luke’s character. Character writing involves, well… characterization. Giving your characters arcs, traits, beliefs, values, and growth. Unless you take the time to show and develop the changes in a character, then it can feel like a wholely different person. And (with no time spent developing the change) the Luke we got in TLJ held none of the traits of, or lessons learned by, Luke in the OT.
Luke had ended the OT being defined by his courage, composure, dedication to his friends, and an unyielding belief that the goodness inside a person is able to overcome the darkness. Luke in the ST showed none of those traits. And I think that undermining the core traits of a beloved character, without even spending time developing those changes, just to make a point, was a bad choice.
That’s the point that I tend to agree with actually.
I will absolutely defend the decision to show Luke in that state from a literary perspective. However, it sucks as a fan. It wasn’t a great decision from a we are a media franchise with fans spanning 50 years.
Instead people just make this shit up and go after stuff that was never shown and never occurred. Never seen any other fandom do this.
It also happens with The Last of Us Part II, which points to a probable cause: the same factually wrong criticisms get repeated not from individual engagement with the original media, but rather with professional shit-stirrers on YouTube. Someone rides the algorithm to dunk on something popular, and their terrible takes are recycled forever.
I think what everyone is honestly mad about is that we had stories in Legends that people were attached to for many years before the movies. I think the biggest offense the movies had was bringing Palps back, which was also unpopular in the comics. My only other gripe is the end. I wanted Ben and Rey standing together, and to see them finally standing together. But that didn’t happen. Other than that it was pretty classic Star Wars stuff. People are just gonna be pissed with big IPs, can’t please everyone.
Wouldn’t have even been that bad bringing palps back if they bothered to give it any exposition.
But no, instead we got
“Somehow”
What’s hilarious is that a Fortnite event was where his broadcast was played; iirc we didn’t even hear it in the actual movie, just that he is back… somehow.
This also means that Fortnite is canonical to the Disney EU.
They read a transcript of it in the movie but not the actual broadcast.
Didn’t they show the whole cloning thing or was that two different movies?
They alluded to it, showing the vats of snoke-esque body parts, as well as the classic “unnatural” line, but they never outright explain it. Basically, unless you’re a hardcore fan who can pick up on the hints, I think you’d have a hard time understanding how he came back. Hence the criticism of the “Somehow” statement. Personally, I just think it is a bad line. It highlights that if the writers really wanted to bring Palpatine back, they would have needed to build up to it throughout the trilogy. By just saying “somehow”, the skip over what could have been a captivating mystery, had they had the time to make it. That, in my opinion, is the biggest flaw of the sequels. The lack of direction with no ending in mind. In my opinion, a good plot twist has clues that build up to the big reveal. That is mostly nonexistent here, as it’s clear Abrams vision in mind when making The Force Awakens. He just wanted to say he made a star wars movie, then move on with his career.
I always thought it was really clearly cloning. Haven’t seen the movie in a long while but never felt like they didn’t explain it.
I mean, sure, but was the Palpatine Anakin killed a clone (therefore reducing his impact)? Is the new palps a clone? Does he have palps consciousness or just a copy of his memories? If he’s a clone, who made him and raised him? He seems pretty old, is it because of accelerated clone aging or because he’s the original?
You know, interesting sci-fi/force things to explore in a sci-fi/force trilogy.
New one was a clone, I just assumed it was 1-1 clone. I don’t think it all needs to be explored and explained. I felt the same way about the force.
Right, I felt it was a waste of fantastic stories to give us a poorly planned one that they’ve been trying to slowly retcon ever since. That’s why we’ve been getting all the mandoverse stuff and why Thrawn is back in the spotlight. They just initially shied away from recasting the OT characters so they could bring that star power to the projects. Sadly even with the star power and nostalgia the story didn’t hit a home run. So now we’re getting a reworked version of the Thrawn trilogy which is what should have been the case from the beginning, and hopefully this version can retcon some events to make the ST feel less jarring.
It wasn’t jarring though. The glaring issue is that they borrowed their main villain reveal from a comic line that was not that popular to begin with. Nobody ever really liked Palps returning even before it was on the silver screen. He had six films lets move on to the One Sith. TFA was a perfect opener to the trilogy, though. Love it.
Completely agree palps should’ve been left in the reactor of the 2nd death star. For all the
worlduniverse building, we see precious little of it outside of the legends novels. I was interested and excited during TFA, but the macguffin chase and nostalgia dump made it feel less of a movie and more like filler setting the stage. What came after was what really disappointed.
I was a non-Legends SW fan who did very much dislike the sequels. I think they were very wasteful with the characters. Instead of developing them and allowing them to organically create the plot, a lot of the plot was forced and the underdeveloped characters had to react to it. The Last Jedi actually did try to do some character development, but it only developed half of them while practically executing the other half. Holdo, Rose, and especially Hux were all victims
Episode 8 man, everyone is like: “I never see it coming, rey is a nobody”, “She is the first one that is not from a lineage”, “A heroine that is not the chosen one for once”. And I’m like she is strong as fuck in the force, without any training and has visions of the past well if she’s not have a reason to be this OP so the force choose her to be OP, if the force chose her SHE IS THE FUCKING CHOSEN ONE.
Let’s try a novel approach and be positive. What’s something you liked about the sequels?
One from each:
- Rey’s dialogue-free introduction.
- Luke’s “Jakuu pretty much is nowhere” line.
- Adam Driver’s evocation of a Harrison Ford-esque smile at the end.
Adam Driver, Daisy Ridley, and Mark Hamill did an amazing job with their roles, in spite of the script they were given.
deleted by creator
What else?
Admiral Holdo earning her place in Asgard for an eternity of mead and roast pig lol
The visual effects were quite good.
X-wings flying in atmosphere at speed.
At the end of the second movie where the main force user wasn’t special and there was going to be an evil duo trying to take over the galaxy.
Are you more of a fan of the original or sequel era star fighter designs?
My personal tastes prefer the original series fighter designs but I see the need to visually differentiate the two eras.
The acting was generally good from pretty much every one
Rey and Finn burgeoning romance hinted at in FA. I really wish they had built on that. Successful or not I can live with but at least try.
Lol thanks for reminding me why I love Star Wars but always avoid the communities and fans at every possible cost 👍
Said while posting in a star wars community and replying to all the comments by fans 🤣😘🤣
Hey, thanks for making StarWars memes. I know making ST memes can generate a lot of… impassioned discussions. But I appreciate seeing the genuine effort on content. So thanks.
deleted by creator
Removed by mod
