- cross-posted to:
- technology@beehaw.org
- linux@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- technology@beehaw.org
- linux@lemmy.ml
I would like to share with you a very cool project that develops drivers for correct operation of Microsoft Surface devices on Linux. I myself use Surface Pro 6 with these drivers and everything works like a charm (battery life is good, cameras work, stylus, keyboard, touchscreen, screen). The developers are gods. From myself, I would recommend using Fedora Linux distribution, as I got the best battery life on it and didn’t experience any additional bugs. If you don’t like GNOME, you can try spins.
Lemmy community. tiddeR community
Links to project resources:
- Home Page.
- Table of supported features.
- Installation Guide.
- Page with known bugs and their solutions.
- Wiki.
Awesome additional resources:
- User experience from Michael Horn.
- Installation instructions (non-official): Link. Link.
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Should also mention Nobara Linux (which is funnily enough based on Fedora) has Surface Linux patches baked into its kernel.
WOW. Such a cool detail! 🤯 Nobara is good.
Nobara looks very good
Especially for gaming.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/79Jj0jWXyWo
https://piped.video/6_EHEmz_j4o
https://piped.video/BreV6N0GApk
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source, check me out at GitHub.
Such a fast bot 😆 Love you! 😍
Yeah it works- and has for quite a while. My SP3 ran Ubuntu fine back in the day, but it didn’t save it from being an unservice-able piece of shit with failing hardware that overheated in 5 seconds flat.
Weird bugs. RIP SP3
Not bugs- it overheated in BIOS. :D
It’s the next evolution of planned obsolescence - it just doesn’t work as soon as you start to use it.
:DDD
It didn’t?!?!
I don’t understand your question.
I am sarcastically shocked that it didn’t prevent the hardware from being shite.
Ha okay. Yeah, no saving that junk heap.
I’m somehow really surprised by the linux community embracing the surface. It’s a horrible piece of hardware. It’s designed to be short lived. Hard to repair or upgrade. Limited connectivity. Etc. I’ve had user come back with their surface where the battery had pushed the screen out.
It’s the best “laptop” I’ve ever owned. Overly expensive, but it’s legitimately the first laptop I’ve had that hasn’t died in a few years. It feels like Microsoft’s response to the Mac-book.
It’s exceptionally bad if one wishes to repair or upgrade, as you stated. Outside of that though - performance, reliability… it’s been pretty good.
As I typed this I remembered that in the past year it’s started hard locking seemingly at random requiring a full shutdown via holding the power button. So, not quite as consistent as a Mac-book.
I’ve supported over the last few years surface pro 4 and hp X2 G4. They are nightmarish devices. The surface pro had constant freeze issues where people had to force restart them, then after two years, the battery wouldn’t last, but we couldn’t change it, because I believe the screen was glued. We had also keyboard and touchpad issues.
Now the X2, same kind of system as the surface, but we have issues where machines become really, really hot. So hot that some have their heat sink burning the displays. We have issue where dust gets in between the display and webcam. Last but not least, your keyboard will die after two year of use, the small connector gets damaged bye folding the keyboard overtime. Making the machine unusable, overtime. Machines that are out of warranty can’t have their keyboard replaced and new keyboard cost a fortune.
Now, if you take any professional grade laptop. Like a Lenovo T or some HP Elite book. You could keep machine in rotation for years after the warranty was over, we had 10+ years old laptop being used as loaner or for short assignments. Because we could upgrade the RAM, HDD->SSD, battery etc. Also don’t get me started on the connector, a surface had 1 USB A one mini DP and a proprietary connector. The x2 3 usb-c port.
The surface are very expensive for what they offer.
IMO, hardware should be very important for the linux community, it must be as important as software!
I appreciate your perspective. Clearly handled a lot more devices than I have over the years. My experience is about 3 laptops, and then a Surface with the latter being my best experience.
When upgrading I’ll look at your recommendations.
I have a microsoft laptop studio and I love it. I had the previous Surfacebook pro and they have solved everything with the studio.
I’m a huge Linux shill, but man I love the surface pro. It’s just such a sexy device lmao. I’ll mainly run Windows on it, because I at least need one Windows device for my work. The surface pro 9 has and easily replaceable battery which is a huge draw for me.
I cannot say I agree.
I am a road warrior, a linux admin and a salesman. I have my SP9 ARM and while ARM on Windows has been a disappointment, the hardware is top notch and does everything I need.
Plus I work in very dirty environments, so it is nice to be able to buy a new keyboard when needed
No good alternatives. Very convenient. That’s it.
There are hundreds of better alternatives, to a MS surface. For linux enthusiasts, hardware should be very important, as important as the software, OS your running.
In similar format? Which?
Like I said, the format to me is the problem, any similar format will have glued or soldered component. It’s highly anti DIY by design.
In a portable computer, I want 14inch screen, Replaceable RAM, SSD and battery, HDMI, USB-A, USB-C, a SIM slot. Maybe SD card and ethernet. I want a laptop format because it’s much more comfortable to work on the go. My work PC is a HP X360 1040 G8. It’s a pretty solide machine it’s not heavy. But HP has soldered the RAM on the motherboard, it has no Network connector and no SD card reader.
HP has also removed the possibility to swap keyboard layouts in their professional range, which is very annoying!
But as people buy into Apple and MS bullshit. Other manufacturers will follow into making computer as unrepairable or upgradable as possible.
So ergo, no real alternatives. People like the 2-in-1 form factor enough for MS to keep on selling them, and that’s why there are people who want to run Linux on them.
I agree that we shouldn’t support such an unrepairable devices. But it is too good not to use it. Sorry. My principles went away here 😁
The Microsoft ❤️ Linux image is a weird choice. WSL is neat but Microsoft will never support Linux on their hardware.
WSL does nothing to further the paradigm of Linux. WSL is a bandage for Windows to make it suck just a tiny bit less, and it generally fails miserably.
Back when I was having issues with the Linux desktop (2016-19), I used WSL to get access to Linux’s useful tools. I was always on and off with Linux, mainly due to having components that don’t work with it well (mainly to do with NVIDIA and Broadcom WiFi).
Now I’m full-on Linux. Only exception is Apple Music (virtual machine) or some gaming scenarios (dualboot). Stuff like mods that work better on Windows, or steering wheel games (I have a Logitech wheel that works so much better on Windows than Linux).
You don’t need an entire VM just for Apple Music! There’s an open source client for it available on Mac and Linux. They just dropped development, but it still works. https://github.com/ciderapp/Cider/releases/tag/v1.6.2
I have tried Cider before. It’s a solid client, but there’s some stuff that’s still missing for me. I can live without lossless audio, but gapless playback when listening to albums is very important for me and Cider doesn’t support it unfortunately.
Totally understandable, them making the project closed-source is making me switch off too, but the last open-source version works in a pinch.
Well, since that comment several hours ago I just set up Apple Music on Waydroid, with lossless. If need be, the Android version of Apple Music works pretty well on Waydroid. There’s some hoops to go through (Google’s certification, the app needing fake WiFi for anything above low-quality AAC) but once it’s done it works.
I didn’t know about the fake Wi-Fi so I just thought it wouldn’t work, Good catch! I’ll use it
where is/was that image? I don’t see it
It was changed 😏
Trigger activated check 😏
Greetings from a Surface Book 2 running Fedora 38! Everything works nicely (dtx included), battery life is great. Switching from W10 to Linux on this machine was probably one of the best decisions I could make.
Fedora 38 is VERY good. Really cool distro. Same here, best decision was to install linux, it is so much snappier and smooth! P.S. cool GNOME extensions pack, looks beautiful!
My pops has a Surface, first Gen. Middle-tier model. It runs Windows 10, poorly. Do you reckon Linux would work on a first-Gen device?
I guess it’s worth a try, maybe go for Fedora KDE spin or something lighter? If he has an Nvidia card in it I’d suggest gettin Pop!_os.
Hmm I’m also still using a surfacebook 2 but with windows 11 and it’s been giving me some issues like hard locks and sometimes overheating. Does the gpu work too or is that not possible? Might switch if that is supported and it does have better battery life.
Surface-linux page for SB2 says their kernel does support Nvidia variants. Not really sure about the battery life because mine only has an iGPU.
It’s actually pretty funny. Back around 2018 I bought an XPS13, being hailed as the golden standard of linux support on a laptop, and my buddy bought a Surface Pro (3 or 4, cant remember). With these patches, his machine not only ran better, but also had 4x the battery life, compared to my fully supported (on paper) machine
wwoohh. Awesome work from Surface side.
I’m currently running EndeavorOS on my Surface Laptop 4. I’ll admit it was a pain to get working right, especially since I have the amd model, but damn once it’s working its so nice.
It is really stable!
I’ve had nothing but issues with Microsoft hardware… Even excluding Xbox stuff, my SP4 had major issues with video corruption and hard freezes. Multiple RMA attempts came back defective or damaged, even the first party folio keyboard went bad. These were widespread defects and once warranty was up I was sol.
The only thing that somewhat extended its life before it went full spicy pillow was putting Linux Mint on it with some kernel patches.
Thank God this community exists, but I’ll never buy another surface product as long as I live.
SP4 was really buggy from Hardware perspective, flickering screen, fast battery drain while off, etc… SP567 are really good devices!
I love my 8 now. The battery is definitely not the best, but the whole device is awesome.
I think it should be really slick device. Glad you’re glad 🙂
I highly recommend it! I’ve been running PopOS! On my Surface Pro 3 for years. It works perfectly, and functions extremely well with the form factor
👍❤️
I guess I’m missing something, but I don’t understand buying a MS hardware product and then installing Linux, surely just buy a different product in the first place?
Same with people buying Google Pixel’s and then removing the stock Android. Isn’t the Pixel’s hardware rubbish, and the only reason to buy it the software?
I’m pro Linux, just not seeing the point of giving money to these companies and then installing Linux… I think some people do it with the Pixel as a protest, which makes little sense when they’ve given money to the company :/
Because some people purchase and use devices for practical purposes, not just ideological.
Perhaps the Surface hardware is the most practical for some people?
Also, Linux Surface is maintained for older devices, which will be useful when Windows 10 support ends.
Jup. Surface Pro: Very lightweight, solid, powerful (for its size), fan-less (some models), both tablet and laptop, has an okay stylus. Whats not to like? Oh, right, the default OS. 😊
And that some models can’t upgrade to 11, so support for them ends when Windows 10 support ends. Linux Surface will extend their life.
Fair enough, I just thought there would be more practical options for price/performance/usability, but I guess touchscreen laptops are a bit of a niche still.
I used to have a Surface when I was at university. They were so much better to lug around than MacBooks or ThinkPads.
☝️😃
In the case of the Surface Go family, there isn’t really anything comparable from other companies. It’s unironically the best compact tablet I’m aware of that you can put Linux on, and it runs Pop!_OS without issue once you disable Secure Boot. The only better Linux tablet for me would be an iPad Mini, but you can’t put Linux on one of those and even if you could it’s ARM-based so most proprietary apps won’t work on it.
In general, your tablet options for something smaller and handier than full-size 2-in-1s are pretty limited if you don’t want to be running iPadOS, so excluding Microsoft’s devices from the running if you want to put Linux on your tablet is pointless. Yeah, buying a Surface Laptop to put Linux on there is a bit weird, but I can see the Surface Pro family yielding a good ARM Linux tablet some day.
Same with people buying Google Pixel’s and then removing the stock Android. Isn’t the Pixel’s hardware rubbish, and the only reason to buy it the software?
Because Pixel allows the removal of stock android where some phones, like Samsung’s, actively prevent it.
But you’re not entirely wrong. There are non-Pixel phones with better hardware and unlockable bootloaders. Often it’s a preference thing. Though it should be said, the more popular the phone, the more likely it has robust support from the custom rom community, and Pixels are popular.
Also, “stock Android” doesn’t mean “everything is accessible and configurable” Android. They may put a Pixel-based rom right back on, just a version that’s not so restrictive. Many don’t need a reason to use custom roms beyond just having more knobs and levers for their phone than stock allows them.
Honestly, one of the major reasons I use Lineage, beyond the big obvious reasons, is solely to keep the “Hold back button to kill foreground app” function that stock android removed long ago.
Pixel phones allow to relock bootloader on Custom ROMS, that’s why developers use Pixel devices. Good firmware support is also around.
Buying new, sure, what you’re saying makes sense. I think buying used for the form factor or whatever and not wanting windows is a fine choice, though.
💯
That pixel’s example is so funny cause its suprisingly the most open boooader out there, so almost no devices but the pixel are used for full custom OS’ like grapheneOS.
But to answer your question, a lot of the beauty of Linux is it runs on anything, so if you already had one lying around, you could just slab Debian or something on it and it’ll be snappier than ever.
I also personally like the form factor of the device and the removable keyboard
Buy used device and you will not give any money to company. Surface devices are just really well built/thought and convenient devices. That’s it.
I wouldn’t say the Pixel line’s hardware is rubbish, more that Google is focused on having a polished “it just works” experience rather than trying to differentiate themselves by having the fastest, biggest, newest hardware in the Android market.
The mobile market hit the “diminishing returns” point quite a while ago and for a lot of people - probably the majority - the only reasons to upgrade are security updates ending, or because a non-replaceable battery is getting to the end of its life.
I used to upgrade every 12-18 months religiously, but now my Pixel 5 is coming up on 3 years old and I’d happily keep it another few years with a battery replacement, if the updates weren’t going to end shortly.
I agree that buying a new Surface to install Linux on doesn’t seem like the way to go.
But I get new life out of older machines by upgrading them with Linux. I’ve gotten additional years of solid use out of some older MacBook Airs by installing Linux. Now that I know there are drivers, I’ve got my eye on upgrading an old Surface Pro that I have.
deleted by creator
I guess I’m missing something, but I don’t understand buying a MS hardware product and then installing Linux, surely just buy a different product in the first place?
most people dont buy this to put linux on it, they get the somehow and then use linux to make them suck less.
Isn’t the Pixel’s hardware rubbish, and the only reason to buy it the software?
not really.
That’s actually very tempting. I always liked the form factor of the surface but I didn’t want windows for it.
Cool project!
Also, consider REFind (https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/REFInd) when you dual boot. It’s the only boot manager that supports touch screens.
Good advice ❤️
Very intersting thanks for the heads up.
My Surface Book 2 is quite long in the tooth at this point, windows drags on it but I imagine linux would fly. I’m surprised to see such extensive support for it.
Very cool and responsible developers, that’s why this is the result.
ITs been a while but last time I tried installing Linux on my surface book 2 it was such a mess and had so many problems.
I’ve been daily driving Fedora with surface-linux kernel on SB2 for over a year. It just works (well, maybe except for the camera).
Good to know! Haven’t tried fedora before.
If it was long time ago maybe you should try it again. Many improvements were made. Also, disable secure boot in BIOS, it is kinda meh on Linux.
Yeah that’s what I’m thinking after reading this. Might be worth a try. I did disable secure boot last time.
❤️
