What’s up with this straight up pro-china and pro-russia stuff on Lemmy lately?

It’s not even praising the people of China and Russia, but rather their gov directly.

Obviously the states have problems, and the EU to a lesser degree, but they at least have some human rights.

Is this some kind of organized disinformation campaign?

  • Cowbee [he/they]
    9•6 days ago

    The working class of the PRC is the class in power! This is chauvanism, why on Earth do you get to say that the working class needs to overthrow the socialist system they support? This is a deeply western viewpoint you have, the Chinese working class already overthrew their oppressors last century.

      • Cowbee [he/they]
        10•6 days ago

        What’s your point, exactly? Is this just an unrelated jab at the DPRK? Are you saying people can only support their governments if they are brainwashed? Brainwashing doesn’t even exist, it was a concept invented by the west to explain why citizens of socialist countries support their system, which they failed to replicate with MKUltra:

        The term “brainwashing” was first used in English by Edward Hunter in 1950 to describe how the Chinese government appeared to make people cooperate with them during the Korean War.

        In 1979, John D. Marks wrote in his book The Search for the Manchurian Candidate that until the MKUltra program was effectively terminated in 1963, the agency’s researchers had found no reliable way to brainwash another person, as all experiments at some stage always ended in either amnesia or catatonia, making any operational use impossible.

        Ultimately, polling in support of the PRC is extremely consistent, even when taken from western orgs.

        According to the most recent report (2024), people in China have overwhelmingly positive views of their political system. 92% of people say that democracy is important to them, 79% say that their country is democratic, 91% say that the government serves the interests of most people (rather than a small group), and 85% say all people have equal rights before the law. Furthermore, China outperforms the US and most European countries on these indicators – in fact, it has some of the strongest results in the world. The figure below compares China’s results to those from the US, France and Britain. These results may help explain the high levels of satisfaction with government reported by the Ash Center.

        You don’t appear to have any point supported by data, just failed Cold War conspiracy theories.

        • @CybranM@feddit.nu
          -9•6 days ago

          Haha, where did you get brainwashing from? I would trust polling from the notorious big-brother state of China about as much as from Russia or NK, that is to say, not much at all.

          • Cowbee [he/they]
            7•6 days ago

            Because this is western polling in China, for one, and for two, the west is also made up of “big brother states.”

            • @CybranM@feddit.nu
              -7•5 days ago

              Doesn’t make much difference if it’s a western poll, the respondents are still in China (correct me if I’m wrong).

              I wouldn’t trust the response from someone in Moscow being interviewed by some western news media either.

              The west is also spying on their own citizens but are obviously not repressing dissent like the three mentioned countries.

              • davel [he/him]English
                8•5 days ago

                Doesn’t make much difference if it’s a western poll, the respondents are still in China (correct me if I’m wrong).

                I wouldn’t trust the response from someone in Moscow being interviewed by some western news media either.

                “What we are dealing with is a nonfalsifiable orthodoxy”. From Michael Parenti’s Blackshirts & Reds:

                In the United States, for over a hundred years, the ruling interests tirelessly propagated anticommunism among the populace, until it became more like a religious orthodoxy than a political analysis. During the cold war, the anticommunist ideological framework could transform any data about existing communist societies into hostile evidence. If the Soviets refused to negotiate a point, they were intransigent and belligerent; if they appeared willing to make concessions, this was but a skillful ploy to put us off our guard. By opposing arms limitations, they would have demonstrated their aggressive intent; but when in fact they supported most armament treaties, it was because they were mendacious and manipulative. If the churches in the USSR were empty, this demonstrated that religion was suppressed; but if the churches were full, this meant the people were rejecting the regime’s atheistic ideology. If the workers went on strike (as happened on infrequent occasions), this was evidence of their alienation from the collectivist system; if they didn’t go on strike, this was because they were intimidated and lacked freedom. A scarcity of consumer goods demonstrated the failure of the economic system; an improvement in consumer supplies meant only that the leaders were attempting to placate a restive population and so maintain a firmer hold over them.

                If communists in the United States played an important role struggling for the rights of workers, the poor, African-Americans, women, and others, this was only their guileful way of gathering support among disfranchised groups and gaining power for themselves. How one gained power by fighting for the rights of powerless groups was never explained. What we are dealing with is a nonfalsifiable orthodoxy, so assiduously marketed by the ruling interests that it affected people across the entire political spectrum.

                The west is also spying on their own citizens but are obviously not repressing dissent like the three mentioned countries.

                Those who do not move, do not notice their chains. — Rosa Luxemburg

                Often we can say whatever we want in the West because often our voices have virtually no political power[1][2], and yet we are silenced & repressed, sometimes violently.

                Just look at this very moment to those speaking out against the genocide of Palestinians that is supported by Western governments. Look at the German government’s repression and arrests, for one.

                I could go on for hours with examples over the last century, including a list of assassinations by Western states of their own people for speaking out.

                • @CybranM@feddit.nu
                  -5•5 days ago

                  Alright, may I ask if you’d trust a poll of North Koreans to be truthful?

                  Often we can say whatever we want in the West because often our voices have virtually no political power[1][2], and yet we are silenced & repressed, sometimes violently.

                  I’ve already asked another commenter this but it’s valid here too: Would you class the western oppression of dissent to be on the same level as that famous student protest in China?

                  • davel [he/him]English
                    3•4 days ago

                    Alright, may I ask if you’d trust a poll of North Koreans to be truthful?

                    That depends on how the hypothetical poll is done. The think that if these particular, multiple, non-hypothetical polls of China by Western organizations that Hikle referred to say that Chinese people feel that their government is working for them, is improving their material conditions. and that their voices are being heard, that is reliable.

                    I’ve already asked another commenter this but it’s valid here too: Would you class the western oppression of dissent to be on the same level as that famous student protest in China?

                    Only someone misinformed about the 1989 protest and US/CIA/NED-orchestrated, murderously violent riot would ask this, which to be fair is 99% of Westerners.

                • @CybranM@feddit.nu
                  -5•5 days ago

                  Does it make you feel powerful to be rude to other people?

                  You’re not forced to read what I write, you can just leave you know

                  • @AntiOutsideAktion@lemmy.mlEnglish
                    4•4 days ago

                    I feel frustration and annoyance watching people argue in bad faith which is then relieved by yelling at them over it

                    it’s not like my criticism is lacking substance.

              • Cowbee [he/they]
                7•5 days ago

                Why on Earth would you not trust Chinese citizens to respond honestly? Further, the west is repressing dissent, just look at what happens to pro-Palestine protestors.

                • @CybranM@feddit.nu
                  -4•5 days ago

                  Why on Earth would you not trust Chinese citizens to respond honestly?

                  Yeah I wonder why

                  Would you class the western oppression of dissent to be on the same level as that famous student protest in China?

                  • Cowbee [he/they]
                    3•5 days ago

                    I’d say western oppression of dissent is at the same level or greater than the PRC, yes. Most importantly, the west is made up of dictatorships of capital, while the working class is in power in the PRC, meaning there are more people that oppose the system in the west than in China.